Points of Controversy

18.9. Of jhāna and its Intervals

Controverted Point: That we see visible objects with the eye.

Theravādin: Then you hold that we see matter by matter… . You deny. But think! And if you now assent, you imply that matter is able to distinguish matter. You deny. But think! And if you now assent, you imply that matter is mind… .

Again, you are implying that the eye can “advert” or reflect, co-ordinate, will, etc., albeit you agree that the contrary is true.

.These arguments hold good for similar claims put forward by you for the other four senses.

Mahāsaṅghikas: But was it not said by the Exalted One:

“Here, bhikkhus, a bhikkhu sees objects with the eye, hears sounds, and so on.”

Hence surely we see visible objects with the eye and so on.